COFSTA

Hey guys, I am "investigating" a possible Sena setup and questions keep popping up. If you happen to know the answers, thanks in advance!

1) How long is the PTT coiled cable when stretched out--not completely stretched out but with a little coil left in it?

2) How long is the PTT extension cable?

3) Is anyone pairing their phone to the SR10 instead of the SMH10 and if so does it work the same as in pairing with the SMH10? If not, how so? Their website says the SR10 is designed for this.

4) Is anyone powering their SR10 from the bike when riding--not just charging when stopped, but all the time? If so, do you get any elec. noise? I see where Sena recommends using a ground loop isolator on the power cable if you do this but no further info. re. it. The only GLI's I have used are on audio cables.

5) And if I pair the phone with the SR10 as in # 3 above, does that free up another channel on the SMH10 to pair up *something* else? I have no idea WHAT but I hate to let any channel go unused.

That is all.

For now..

beemerbob wrote:1) How long is the PTT coiled cable when stretched out--not completely stretched out but with a little coil left in it?

About 24", pulled but not maxed-out.

2) How long is the PTT extension cable?

Mine's 72".

Someone else will have to chime in with the others; I multi-point pair my SMH10 to the phone (music only, no calls) and SR10.

3) Is anyone pairing their phone to the SR10 instead of the SMH10 and if so does it work the same as in pairing with the SMH10? If not, how so? Their website says the SR10 is designed for this.

The actual pairing sequence is the same as with the SMH... hold pairing button down (8 seconds, LED flashes to indicate that it's searching) and set your phone to discoverable... on my Galaxy S4 phone, a widget pops open asking me if I want to connect the devices- the two pair, showing the SR10 as 'headset' profile.

4) Is anyone powering their SR10 from the bike when riding--not just charging when stopped, but all the time? If so, do you get any elec. noise? I see where Sena recommends using a ground loop isolator on the power cable if you do this but no further info. re. it. The only GLI's I have used are on audio cables.

5) And if I pair the phone with the SR10 as in # 3 above, does that free up another channel on the SMH10 to pair up *something* else? I have no idea WHAT but I hate to let any channel go unused.

If you plug it in to a cig outlet you will get noise. Jim said they tell you not to power it that way. I think Don had his powered to his battery. Fwiw the battery on the SR10 lasts a long time. Never had it go out on a long days ride but I have had the SMH die after 10 hours.
Why would you want to pair phone to SR10? When you have phone paired to SMH IT SAYS phone connected. Then it says device connected for SR10. Like Ed said the key is to do the Multi point pairing that gives you everything you would want like Music and phone calls. Since he SMH TALKS TO YOU, you know when it is done correctly. That might be more difficult since the SR10 does not give you the same audible indications.
My question is will the new 20s pair to the SR10? I would assume so but they don't say it on their site.

Broz

Hey guys, thanks a million for all the expert info. Ain't this a great resource--ask questions and get answers from folks you can trust!!

As for pairing the phone with the SR10, I'd just like to try it and see how it operates--if there's any advantage or disadvantage. The website calls the SR10 a "Bluetooth handsfree gateway for mobile phones" so they clearly intended for it to be used that way. But if it doesn't function as well.....but I keep thinking about some of the glitches that have come up periodically (can't remember specifics) and wonder if things may work more smoothly if the SMH10 has only one paired BT connection instead of 2 (phone plus the SR10).....?

As a side note, I have been reading some user reviews of the new 20S and they are not all that great. Issues with build quality and annoying shit, like wind vibrations causing it to think someone is tapping a button therefore it keeps telling the user "Say A Command!" over and over. I would probably stomp mine into little pieces if that happened. And lotsa folks complained about the lack of *real* technical support from Sena, i.e. they have no real answers to the issues but will gladly send you out a new unit in hopes you will just STFU until the 2 year warranty runs out.

Or so they say.... Anyway, I am still checking this stuff out. Thanks again!

In my ongoing BT investigation, I ran across this--it may sound familiar to a couple of our current SMH10 users so I thought I'd post it. I have been on the receiving end of static from Broz recently and since its sporadic this could point to a cause....

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthre ... light=sena

Thanks for the link, Bob. I have an issue with hearing different "volume" from each user. Your non-Sena is always louder than Broz's Sena transmision. Lee's transmission is different than Broz's and so on and so on. On occation, I do expierience "clackling" from Sena users but it goes away when we complain and someone "reboots" their SR10 (Broz).

If you want to experiment on a SMH10 with your stuff, let me know as we are close.

yamadog wrote:....I have an issue with hearing different "volume" from each user. Your non-Sena is always louder than Broz's Sena transmision. Lee's transmission is different than Broz's and so on and so on...

Microphone positioning and voice characteristics could also be a factor with this, probably difficult to get them all to "match".

But it reminds me of something else I just read: the Sena "announcements" often come thru at ear-splitting level with the volume for everything else set for a comfortable level. Anybody notice this? Any way to adjust it?

Another question: when wearing foam earplugs, is the iphone volume sufficiently loud or do you run it full blast and it still seems soft?

I wear foam E-A-R ~29dB plugs on our rides; with the stock Sena speakers, I usually run the F4011 at full volume and the SMH10 mostly so... without the earplugs, that combination would be painfully too loud for me (especially the ear-shattering boot-up tone from the F4011).

"How loud" music plays might depend somewhat on the device sending; I use the S4 phone and an iPad2 to stream music via BT to my receiver at the house, and the iPad2 plays noticeably louder than the S4 (although I may have contributed to this, by telling my computer to normalize/levellize the volume of the playlist). In any event, the S4-to-SMH10 "media connected" link plays more loudly than I'd care to have it while riding.

Thanks Ed!

'Nother queston: I read there is a 1/2 second delay for any audio input to the SR10 before you would hear it on your SMH10. Does this create any issues for anyone? I do use the GPS audio prompts and it could mean the difference between hearing "left turn in point-seven miles" or just "point-seven miles" or even "7 miles make a LEFT"--anyway you get the picture. Also, is there a 1/2 second delay on outgoing radio transmissions when you press the PTT ?

And if you're someone who hates those GPS audio prompts, it may be because you get too many, like every damn "via point" announcement.
I don't (usually) get those and find the turn-by-turn pretty helpful--keeps my eyes on the road more instead of watching the screen for a turn.

Neither of my GPS units outputs sound via external-speaker jack or BT, so I dunno.

FWIW a double-tap on the PTT will hold the SR10-to-SMH10 link 'active' (i.e., not in standby), and I typically use that feature as it seems to noticeably reduce/decrease the delay on incoming radio chatter; IIRC Yarbi tried it, and said it overrode his music-to-SMH10 link so he couldn't hear tunes when the double-tap was active but I don't recall the rest of his config that day.

That, now that I ponder on it might be an incentive to pipe music to the SMH10 via the SR10 BT linkup, rather than multi-point pairing the mp3 source directly to the SMH10... no idea how that might relate to other input prioritization (e.g., a speaker-out feed to the SR10 from GPS).

Ed wrote:Neither of my GPS units outputs sound via external-speaker jack or BT, so I dunno.

FWIW a double-tap on the PTT will hold the SR10-to-SMH10 link 'active' (i.e., not in standby), and I typically use that feature as it seems to noticeably reduce/decrease the delay on incoming radio chatter; IIRC Yarbi tried it, and said it overrode his music-to-SMH10 link so he couldn't hear tunes when the double-tap was active but I don't recall the rest of his config that day.

That, now that I ponder on it might be an incentive to pipe music to the SMH10 via the SR10 BT linkup, rather than multi-point pairing the mp3 source directly to the SMH10... no idea how that might relate to other input prioritization (e.g., a speaker-out feed to the SR10 from GPS).

Interesting observations. So the 1/2 second delay on incoming radio chatter can be (mostly) eliminated by a double tap to keep the SR10 "active". Didn't know that! And Yarbi's experience would indicate that the 1/2 second delay is coming from the SMH10, not the SR10, assuming he was pairing his phone directly to the SMH10. So it sounds like the SR10's output is continuous, and any "sorting out" of the signals is happening at the SMH10.....

Which may also mean, if you are paired up with another rider, you wouldn't be able to keep the SR10 channel "active" but should still be able to use the GMRS, albeit with a 1/2 second delay...?

These are all reasons I want to explore the SR10's full capabilities. Something tells me it does much more than Sena's instructions can impart.

Can't say, re: behaviors of the native SMH-to-SMH full-duplex linkups... have only used that feature a few times, and never in conjunction with a secondary input.

Ed, when you double-tap the PTT does it alert you either with tones or voice that you've changed something? And when you also "undo" the double-tap?

And I wonder about the battery consumption for both units when the double tap has been done.

As an aside... I have had minimal "problems" with my SR10/SMH10 setup compared to some others, but I'm not in any sense probing the boundaries of its' capabilities; juggling radio chatter, music-in, GPS-in, and whatever-else in while taking multiple phone calls on/off hook simultaneously like some guys :coughBrozcough: might just be more than the SMH10 can keep sorted over the course of several hours' usage without a reboot to clear its' mind.

Bob, there's no tone or alert per se, but you can hear a soft 'tssh' sort of channel-open sound if it's otherwise quiet (that is, not over wind or bike noise). Another double-tap resets it to 'normal'.

As far as battery usage- I've been running mine that way for a couple of years, and it's never yet gone dark before I got home... it's on from before I meet you 'til I roll in to the house, and typically left 'on' through lunch.

Ed wrote: Bob, there's no tone or alert per se, but you can hear a soft 'tssh' sort of channel-open sound if it's otherwise quiet (that is, not over wind or bike noise). Another double-tap resets it to 'normal'.

OK--maybe that Tsssh sound is background noise being played back thru a side tone to your speakers...? Or is there a side tone?

I did not know about a double tap but I do know a triple tap will cut the connection from the SMH to the SR10 for 3 minutes. This is used to silence radio chatter when you're taking a phone call. One tap re connects.
Bob sounds like I need to lend you the SR & SMH and let you figure everything out.

Broz wrote:I did not know about a double tap but I do know a triple tap will cut the connection from the SMH to the SR10 for 3 minutes...One tap re connects.
Bob sounds like I need to lend you the SR & SMH and let you figure everything out.

WRONG, ye non-reader of the holy owners scriptures. It take 2 taps to reconnect. All I did was RTFM.

beemerbob wrote:OK--maybe that Tsssh sound is background noise being played back thru a side tone to your speakers...?

Dunno... just sounds like the channel being opened

Or is there a side tone?

Yes, on the SMH10- if you enable it

Ed wrote:

beemerbob wrote:OK--maybe that Tsssh sound is background noise being played back thru a side tone to your speakers...?

Dunno... just sounds like the channel being opened

Or is there a side tone?

Yes, on the SMH10- if you enable it

You got me on that one Ed, lol. But I AM RTF'ing the manuals--just finished the SR10---SMH10 is next!

beemerbob wrote:

Broz wrote:I did not know about a double tap but I do know a triple tap will cut the connection from the SMH to the SR10 for 3 minutes...One tap re connects.
Bob sounds like I need to lend you the SR & SMH and let you figure everything out.

WRONG, ye non-reader of the holy owners scriptures. It take 2 taps to reconnect. All I did was RTFM.

1 tap 2 taps... Who's counting?

I did read the manuals from cover to cover but it's been 2 years and they don't tell you what to do when you get "R2D2"

I usually ride with my faceshield open to some degree, sometimes completely open. Does anyone else do this? The reason I ask is sometimes I'll hear wind noise from another rider and then they close their faceshield and its quiet again. The mic with my Autocom is noise limiting and directional so I seem to "get away" with riding with open shield, rarely does anyone complain about wind noise. Not sure I could do this with the Sena as the mic seems a lot more sensitive. For instance I can often hear the rider's engine over the radio as he accel's. Broz's really comes thru clearly.

So who rides with open shield?

I do at times, although it's generally closed when we're either a.) going fast or b.) gabbing on the comm a lot... some aspect of the visor-up airflow of this RF-1100 creates a 'whistling' sound above ~45mph which gets annoying fairly quickly.

May be different now on the Bandit, since my attitude on the bike has changed so much (in more ways than one lol).

Steve said his kids had open face helmets and it was noisy w Sena.

Broz wrote:Steve said his kids had open face helmets and it was noisy w Sena.

"Open-faced helmets" means no chin bar, right? yep, that would definitely be noisy, with any system.

I usually have mine open to the first detent.... Pretty much all the time.

Brick wrote:I usually have mine open to the first detent.... Pretty much all the time.

OK--this is helpful--thx. You're riding a very similar bike/windscreen/fairing setup and I never hear noise on your end. First detent for me too--all the time--but sometimes open all the way when weather and bug populations allow.

I have read both SR10 & SMH10 owners manuals. Here's where I'm at so far:

The upsides to moving to Sena from an Autocom setup (for me anyway):
1) No more cord running to headset
2) Ability to control phone thru SMH10
3) Eliminate a large rats nest of wiring under the seat, making access to battery much easier, and freeing up a little space for *something*.
4) I would only have a 12V power cable, a radar detector audio cable, and a SR10 PTT cable running into the tank bag, eliminating the myriad of cables that currently tether my tank bag to the bike, making removal very difficult.
5) The *possibility of 2-way comm using BT (this is a whole nother topic)

Downsides:
1) The Autocom setup is already there, paid for, and works all the time with no fuss or latency. (I had to work that term in somewhere )

So yeah, theres a few more upsides than downsides. Now I need to read the 20S owners manual and compare the features to the SMH10. I will report back on my findings.

beemerbob wrote:I have read both SR10 & SMH10 owners manuals.

If you can read the SR10/SMH10/20S firmware release notes without having to go through the registration process, you might find occasional snippets of useful feature-set info there too to support the manual.

Just skimmed thru the 20S owners manual. It is identical feature-for-feature with the SMH10 except for a couple of worthwhile improvements--of which FM radio is NOT one.

1) The "Group Intercom" is the main improvement that allows you to link up several riders on BT using a smartphone app to choose the "friends" you'd like to include. Of course, at some prior point, you must have created those friends for them to already exist in the system, and that process seems like a royal pain in the ass. Maybe it isn't--but it sure looks like it.

From the owners manual:
"Group Intercom allows you to instantly create a multi-way conference
intercom of up to eight participants. You can create and start Group
Intercom through your Smartphone App.
1. Start your Smartphone App and go to ‘Group Setting’.
2. Browse your friends, and select up to seven other people you
want to group with.
3. Check your friends and press ‘Save to My 20S’ on the screen.
4. Press ‘Connect’ on the screen or the Ambient Mode Button for 1
second to begin Group Intercom."

2) Improved range--"UP TO 1.2 miles"---the phrase "UP TO" clearly covers the range from 0 to 1.2 miles and anything in between. In practice, I have read where owners got very little improvement if any over the SMH10 except maybe in a wide-open flat stretch of road. It still loses contact if riders are separated by heavy vegetation or a rise in the road or negotiatiing twisties (think NC80, 226A).

For roughly $130 more for the 20S, I would most likely stick to the SMH10, a somewhat known quantity. Unless everyone else was using the 20S.

Ed wrote: If you can read the SR10/SMH10/20S firmware release notes without having to go through the registration process, you might find occasional snippets of useful feature-set info there too to support the manual.

Ed, great tip! I read thru the release data and they did in fact address several shortcomings in the 20S that folks were bitching about. I really do like the smartphone app feature, which will do more than just set up a BT intercom call. They added a volume boost function for people complaining the 20S's volume was a lot softer than the SMH10's. Wonder why they can't see all this crap in the first place?

Bob they claim longer battery life too on the 20s. I thought the smart phone app looks like a real nice feature too. Using the SMH10 once you have paired with another 10 future meet ups were almost instant pairing. At least that's been my experience with Brick and riding cross counter with Yarbi.
My dad is in the market for a new Sena we are probably going to split a pair of 20S'.
Broz

Broz wrote:Bob they claim longer battery life too on the 20s.

13 hours talk time vs 12 hours. Not a big improvement--I wonder how they measure that? Still, it does have some new useful features....

From what I've seen of the 20S's enhancements, none are especially germane to my needs; as I've said before- if my SMH10 crapped out tomorrow, I'd get another SMH10

If my SMH10 died I would get the 20. YMMV

Time for one of you guys to quit dicking around and get the 20S!

Broz, hurry up and get that pair of 20S's on order. We need a guinea pig!

Done. My dad ordered a pair for $426. I will find out where. They are closer to $496 at Revzilla